In this episode of Mastering CS: Candid Leader Insights, Irina Cismas talks with Talia Stryker, Senior Enterprise Customer Success Manager at Clever, the platform that connects schools to their learning apps.
She explains why every implementation has to be a group project, how multithreading and equal business stature protect accounts through leadership turnover, and how call transcripts helped her become the true voice of the customer without a technical background.
What You’ll Learn
- Why adoption works best as a group project
- How to protect accounts before a key contact leaves
- How equal business stature helps you reach decision makers
- How AI transcripts make technical conversations easier to handle
- Why revenue is a lagging indicator of value
- How to beat imposter syndrome in a career change
Key Insights & Takeaways
Make it a group project. A secure setup means nothing without bottom-up adoption across every department.
Multithread from day one. Build relationships top-down and bottom-up so you never rely on one contact.
Don’t wait for a crisis to meet executives. Prove value proactively, not only at renewal or escalation.
Claim your seat at the table. Shared goals give you the same reason to be in the room as a CEO.
Let customers speak for themselves. Transcripts give product the customer’s own words, not just your interpretation.
Numbers lag behind value. Owning a target should never make you transactional.
Be the guide on the side. You don’t need to be the most technical person in the room to lead.
Podcast transcript
Irina (0:06 – 0:36)
Welcome to Mastering CS Candid Leader Insights, the podcast where we dive into the world of customer success with industry leaders. I’m your host, Irina Cismas, and today I’m joined by Talia Stryker, Senior Enterprise Customer Success Manager at Clever, a platform that connects schools to their learning apps. Talia, I’m really happy to have you here.
Thanks for joining. Thank you so much. I’m so happy to be here.
Paint us a picture of your work at Clever. What does customer success work look like day to day?
Inside Customer Success at Clever
Talia (0:37 – 1:56)
Yeah, so Clever is an interesting organization in that we sit at the intersection of school districts and application partners. So there are two customer success teams, one for application partners and one for school districts, and obviously both are served very differently, as they have very different needs. So I work on the school district side of the house, and my team is called the big district success team, or actually we just changed to school success team, my apologies, because Clever is now an international company and school districts are not; they’re only called school districts in the United States.
So we are now school success managers, yes, and our team serves the United States school districts that have 40,000 students plus. So that’s why we consider ourselves an enterprise team as we work with school systems, school organizations that are run like an enterprise organization. And is it mainly, do you mainly serve U.S., or is it, you mentioned international, do you go above U.S.? So my team serves U.S., having said that, we have recently expanded to be an international company. We have customer success teams stood up in Britain and in South America too.
Keeping Cybersecurity on the Agenda
Irina (1:57 – 2:03)
Okay, and right now, what’s the one thing that you are trying to move the most?
Talia (2:05 – 3:25)
Yeah, so right now is a really interesting time of year for the folks that I serve, it’s back to school. So that means that our customers are extremely busy, are under a ton of pressure and stress, just making sure that their students and their teachers are able to access not only their programs, but so much more than that. So school districts in the United States right now are being asked to limit screen time, limit and adopt AI policies, and continue to serve their students and their teachers with fewer resources than ever before with the sunsetting of COVID related funds.
And so right now, I’m actually trying to move the needle on ensuring that amongst all of these different priorities, my customers, my main contacts are still thinking about cybersecurity, which is not to be self-deprecating, but not the sexiest of topics, especially when there’s so many competing priorities right now, specifically AI, which is a very sexy topic. And so right now, again, really trying to work with my administrators to make sure that they’re not losing sight of the things that are extremely important, and if neglected, can be really harmful, like securing their student and teacher identities.
Onboarding as a Group Project
Irina (3:27 – 3:34)
Speaking of this, what does good onboarding look like with a big district? Who do you need in the room early?
Talia (3:35 – 5:35)
Yeah, yeah. So at Clever, one of our main cultural tenets is Clever is a group project, and it’s something that we really live and breathe in my company. I would hope that if you ask any human throughout Clever on any team, that they would mirror that cultural tenant and mirror the philosophy that they share.
And so I would actually say that that’s the thing that I share most with my customers, is that you need to make Clever a group project at your school district or in your school in order to see it succeed. So you could have an incredibly secure base where your Clever platform is, again, very secure, very organized, very role specific. But if we don’t have a bottoms up adoption on keeping a secure space, then it doesn’t really matter.
And so ensuring that the goal is clear and that the entire community has really embraced this ethic of keeping a secure platform and really keeping cybersecurity hygiene at the forefront, then we have what we need. And so we do really like to make sure that we multithread from the very get go. We can have an amazingly, again, set up instance.
And since we work with school districts, if we don’t train everybody how to use it, it doesn’t get used. So different departments, different people, different purviews, they’re all in the room. And then, of course, best customer success practices always call for a deep understanding of what the district is trying to accomplish with a deep understanding of where our roadmap is going and a real strategic intersection so that we know exactly where we can really enrich the partnership on each side of the house.
So, yeah, I mean, I think we all like to say the clear eyes, full hearts can’t lose type of philosophy as long as we keep the mission and the goal clear, as long as we have the right people in the room. We’re set up for success.
Every District Is Different
Irina (5:36 – 6:00)
Because the industry, I’m not familiar with the industry, but does it happen that one district where district different districts have different priorities or different use cases or they want to achieve different things and the value you provide is different? Where are they or are they the same?
Talia (6:01 – 6:40)
Yeah, such a good question. So I always like to say that because every single school district is custom, so is every single Clever instance. And again, speaking internationally, every school system, every school org is different.
So every Clever instance is going to be different. And for anyone who doesn’t understand what Clever does, it’s basically the Okta of education. So kids log in, they’re able to use one password, one identity, and they’re able to reach all of the applications that they have on one screen.
And for the younger kiddos, I actually have a daughter, she’s in first grade, she can use a badge so she can QR code in. Yeah, it’s really efficient.
Irina (6:41 – 6:52)
Mine is in year two, in British school, it’s year two. Oh, really? So I’m actually waiting for the access in a similar school platform.
So I’m looking for the credentials for this.
Talia (6:52 – 7:48)
Well, Irina, I happen to know an organization who does business in Britain, just saying. So yeah, it’s again, it’s a really, it’s an amazing platform. And as you might imagine, of course, every school system has a different plan for how best to leverage this platform.
And so yes, every single implementation is completely custom. And the goals of each implementation are critical to ensure that this absolutely crucial piece of infrastructure is implemented correctly. And because you’re involving identities, and because student identities are full on hunted on the internet, because they’re so expensive, they’re much more expensive than adult data, it just needs to be done with a level of fidelity that is really unparalleled, I think, in well, maybe not unparalleled, that’s a little bit unfair, but it’s just of the utmost importance, again, to implement well.
Surviving Leadership Turnover
Irina (7:50 – 8:07)
I think big districts see a lot of leadership change, or at least I see it at my at my school. So leadership change a lot. When a key contact leaves, how do you keep the account steady?
What how do you make sure that you don’t lose the account once the person left?
Talia (8:09 – 10:50)
Oh, yes, the customer success issue that we’ve all faced throughout every single industry is what happens when your key contact leaves what happens when there’s turnover. And I think that we would probably all agree that the best way to handle leadership turnover is to prepare for it before it happens. So on my team, we have a very strong ethic of being relationship based.
And so multi threading is just core to how we manage accounts. And again, with a platform like clever, you really do have to multi thread in order to make it successful. Our implementers are key.
They are also different from our main contacts, our main executive contacts. And so relationships are strong from the bottom up and the top down, so that we never only have one contact ever. We do build relationships across departments from the beginning.
And we’re very obsessed with maintaining executive relationships, both proactively and often. We get into the schools on campus at least once a year to do an executive overview. We prove value whenever we can.
We help our implementers tell their own story as well to make sure that we continue to make them shine and continue to make them the champion. And of course, we never wait for a renewal or an escalation or a leader to departure to meet executives. When we do our jobs right, and I think that’s a big statement, but I’m willing to stand by it.
And clever is implemented while it becomes part of the fabric of the district’s identity. And well, no pun intended, but actually identity and access management strategy. And that relationship doesn’t work with one person.
So that’s the idea. We also have engaged in the practice, a Sandler methodology called equal business stature, which is an incredibly powerful methodology, which basically claims that the people in the room with you, whether you are a individual contributor and the other person on the other end is a chief executive officer, it’s easy to be intimidated. But it’s also what equal business stature says is that if we’re accountable to the same outcome and working toward the same mission, then we have the same reason to be at the table.
And we both have the same stature in being there. And so that’s also enabled me to really boldly ensure that I always have a contact. So if someone is leaving and I do have to say like, Hey, I don’t want to have to scramble to rebuild account when our leader leaves.
I can actually just, again, use my equal business stature to say, I need to meet the person at the top. I need to meet the decision maker, because et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. But having the confidence to say that is something I’ve had to work on and it’s helpful.
How the Team Stays Organized
Irina (10:51 – 11:23)
Based on what you describe, it feels very white glove approach and personalized and a lot of, I would say one-on-one interactions in person rather than virtually on Zoom. I’m curious, do you need an operational infrastructure so that you guys can function as a CS teams? Do you rely on tools and on the standard tech stack in your case to operate?
Talia (11:24 – 11:26)
Oh my gosh, so much.
Irina (11:26 – 11:37)
From a CS operational perspective, not the tool, how do you guys organize? Where do you keep the information? How do you organize yourselves?
Yeah.
Talia (11:37 – 12:07)
I mean, great question. Different answer every day. Just kidding.
No, we’re not. Yeah. I will say that my manager has really empowered us all to be the CEO of our own books, which I think is really amazing leadership.
And so ask a different person on my team, how they organize their books, and you’re going to get a different answer. I know that the question isn’t about tooling, but I have to mention my AI tools because that’s actually what’s allowed me.
AI as the Voice of the Customer
Irina (12:07 – 12:15)
It’s actually important. And I’m curious, what are the AI tools and the AI use cases? That would have been my next question.
Talia (12:16 – 13:12)
Yep. So I come from ed tech and this Clever is actually IT, which it is also ed tech. It’s totally also ed tech because it’s technology used in the education space, but it’s IT work in that it’s the plumbing that keeps the school district running.
Whereas I always used to think of ed tech or I now there’s nuance in that I now consider ed tech technology used to increase student learning outcomes. So assessment platforms and practice platforms. All of that is to say that I didn’t come to Clever as a technical person at all.
I come from the classroom and then I went to… I know that you’ve been a teacher. Yeah.
Yes, exactly. And then I went to do assessments. And so when I came to Clever, I was not a technical person working with a hugely technical product.
We have Gong and Granola at Clever.
Irina (13:13 – 13:13)
Yeah.
Talia (13:13 – 14:40)
And they are my absolute lifelines. If I didn’t have Gong one day, I don’t know if I could work.
I think I’d have to call out. I’ve become so reliant on having my transcripts. It’s what’s enabled me to do my job like an expert without being one.
Having transcripts of customer conversations means that I can go back and forth through a technical problem until I actually understand it. I can use Gong and Granola to make complicated technical conversations digestible. I can understand a problem before I try and solve it.
I can communicate better across product, engineering, support, etc. And it allows me to build stronger business cases for product. I think that in other words, AI has allowed me to actually become the actual voice of the customer.
And that is an incredibly powerful tool. Instead of product only getting my interpretation, they can literally hear or read what the customer says. And it’s allowed me to get intimate with my source material, which is amazing.
And yes, it’s absolutely a time saver. Tactically, I’ll use AI to do my like NPR notes once a month where it’ll go into Claude and be able to summarize my account activity for X and O. I try not to use it for email.
I like my human touch, but it’s been a huge game changer for me. I mean, I will stand 10 toes down and it’s interesting working in an industry that is looking to limit it a lot. I’m working on my own feelings there and we’ll see what they look like at the end of all this.
Owning a Number Without Being Transactional
Irina (14:41 – 14:51)
I know that in the past, you’ve carried the renewal and expansion number. And I’m curious, what does owning a number change about how you work with the district?
Talia (14:52 – 17:02)
Yeah. Yeah. Great question.
So before I came to Clever, I would have said that I used to carry a number. And now that I’m still at Clever or now that I’m at Clever, which by the way, I’ve been at Clever for years, but I would say that I actually still carry a number. So Clever rostering and SSO are free to schools.
So when I go to renew a customer, if it’s my typical customer that only has rostering and SSO, there’s no renewal conversation. It’s not money. Money is not exchanged.
For those customers, the number is carried in the number of connections that a district has to applications. And so I do always have a North Star. Metrics are really important to me.
The metrics are important to all of us. And so that North Star is still something that I’ve always got my eye on. And I do also have a GRR and an NRR number now because Clever now sells device-less student MFA and identity management products to school districts.
And so I do have a renewal number as well. It’s just far fewer transactions than when I was at a larger company. Yeah.
And so I think that what’s different at Clever is there’s a ton more nuance in how I’m evaluated than I have at other companies. So I know I’ve jumped around a little bit, but I would like having a number has never made me more transactional with customers. My manager used to say at my last company that if anything, having a number should teach you that it’s usually a lagging indicator of whether we’re actually delivering value.
And so yes, I definitely always still have my eyes on the number. It’s less of a me-centric, how am I going to fill my own book? And more of a, yeah, a group project.
Like how are we going to make up for this number? It doesn’t affect my pocketbook. So it’s just a different, again, a different kind of way of looking at it, but still an important metric.
Beating Imposter Syndrome
Irina (17:04 – 17:16)
You’ve been a teacher, a software trainer, and now an enterprise CSM. Is there a habit, a way of thinking or something you learned the hard way early on that still shows up in how you run accounts today?
Talia (17:18 – 19:33)
Yes. Yes. Oh gosh.
Oh my gosh. I waffled with this one. There’s two key through lines and they’re related.
So I, when I was transitioning from the classroom, it was probably one of the hardest times of my life. It was certainly one of the, well, top two hardest moments of my career. Just the imposter syndrome was just awful.
Like I, teachers are magic. Teachers can do anything. Hire teachers.
They are the Swiss army knife of human beings. They’re incredible, but they’re not qualified for any job outside of the classroom because of a bias in different industries that teachers have just been teachers. And what I now know is that you don’t have to be the smartest person in the room or the most technical person in the room or the most qualified person in the room.
You might be all those things, by the way. I might’ve been that when I was leaving the classroom, but I was just a teacher. But as long as you understand your audience and you translate effectively and you bring the right people together, that’s what you need.
You don’t need to what we used to say in the classroom is the sage on the stage. You can be the guide on the side. And that imposter syndrome, it’s not real.
It’s really difficult to remind myself of that, especially as a female. And equal business stature, which I talked about earlier, is like the hardest possible thing for me to get on board with because that imposter syndrome does live deep in me. And because it’s really difficult to get through and recover from, but it’s been a really powerful reminder that I actually do have the skills that I need to do the job that I need, even though I’m not a technical person, even though I’m not a leader in my company, et cetera.
I do have the experience and the expertise to do an amazing job with these districts. And I do. So owning my wins is another one that’s been really hard, but important.
Yeah. So that’s, I think, I hope that made sense, but yeah.
Irina (19:33 – 19:47)
For sure it did. And it was a nice touch at the end of this conversation. It was a really interesting one and thanks for taking the time to talk to me and share your story with our audience.
Talia (19:48 – 19:50)
It’s such a pleasure. Thank you so much for having me.
Irina (19:51 – 19:57)
To everyone listening, thanks for tuning in. Until next time, stay curious, keep learning and mastering customer success.
